IRC logs of #tryton for Friday, 2009-01-09 #tryton log beginning Fri Jan 9 00:00:01 CET 2009
vengfulsquirrelbechamel`: okay thanks, ha I'm learning so much today00:00
bechamel`vengfulsquirrel: great00:01
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vengfulsquirrelbechamel`: Sorry I have another question, can a move functionally exist without belonging to a packing ?  I've created a move directly but I don't understand how I can change its state from Draft to Assigned ?  Is the proper way to create a packing with a single move and work from the packing's perspective ?00:28
bechamel`vengfulsquirrel: yes move are low-level object and normaly you should always use packing00:29
bechamel`vengfulsquirrel: it's the goal of internale packings00:29
bechamel`vengfulsquirrel: but as you can see in the TODO of the trunk version, withdraw packing are missing, so atm it's not possible to return product to the supplier or to get back product from the customer (at least there is no automation for this)00:33
X0d_of_N0dhey vengfulsquirrel, Sorry I didn't get back to you sooner.. I've been pretty sick. how's it going?00:34
vengfulsquirrelX0d_of_N0d: Yeah I was sick in early december for like 2 weeks, it was terrible.  I haven't made much quantifiable ground on the MRP stuff, I've just been reading those books I bought.  There are just so many configurations that are possible.  Also those books aren't very meaty, except the models book.   Although they have familiarized me more with the topic though.  Ha originally I thought routings and workcenters were just conc00:39
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vengfulsquirrelX0d_of_N0d: If that's an acronym I don't know what it stands for.00:45
X0d_of_N0dno it looks like you got cut off00:45
X0d_of_N0dworkcenters were just conc00:46
vengfulsquirrelOriginally I thought routings and workcenters were just concepts that tiny had made up.00:46
vengfulsquirrelYeah for some reason it didn't show over here that I got cut off.00:47
X0d_of_N0dahh ok00:47
X0d_of_N0dvengfulsquirrel: might be a setting on my client00:47
X0d_of_N0dyeah, I've been reading this book about boms....pretty useless actually. Basically the half way through the book and the only idea I've seen is "you should use one bom database instead of multiple databases"00:48
vengfulsquirrelHa yeah a bunch of the stuff in these books was totally useless, but there was some good things.00:48
X0d_of_N0dI'm still pondering how to address your workflow00:51
vengfulsquirrelYeah I'm pretty sure I only need a minor modification to MRP I.00:52
vengfulsquirrelEverything else can be done 'manually' so to speak.00:52
X0d_of_N0dI was thinking we could add something like triggered events00:52
X0d_of_N0dso what were you thinking as far as the mod to mrp I00:54
vengfulsquirrelI can just use lead times and boms to do rough scheduling of when to start production runs.00:54
vengfulsquirrelThe modification to the rough scheduling would be that certain production runs can only occur during certain date ranges.00:54
vengfulsquirrelSo like each single level bom would have a lead time AND a list of acceptable planning periods that it could start in.00:55
X0d_of_N0dso the thing to do would be to impliment mrp I00:55
X0d_of_N0dand add an extra extension to that as a seperate module, perhaps00:56
vengfulsquirrelYeah pretty much that was my plan.  I guess I was just reading still to see how independent, model-wise, the Closed Loop and MRP II ideas were.00:57
vengfulsquirrelIdeally you'd want to just install a Closed-Loop module and then a MRP II module if necessary.  And they would just extend MRP I.00:58
X0d_of_N0dthe module should probabbly be renamed to avoid confusion00:58
X0d_of_N0ddepending on what kind of work you're doing00:58
X0d_of_N0dit seems like some kind of expiration date module would be useful too...just not sure how to impliment that correctly01:01
X0d_of_N0dor what to call it01:01
vengfulsquirrelYeah for plants you mean ?01:01
X0d_of_N0dplants or food, it would be the same01:02
X0d_of_N0dor beer01:02
vengfulsquirrelThat's kind of something that would happen within the stock domain though.01:02
X0d_of_N0din brewing you boil your beer, then drop it in to a primary fermenting tank... then after 2 weeks you drop it into a secondary tank and add more hops...01:02
vengfulsquirrelMy business doesn't do lots or individual product tracking so that doesn't really work to well.01:02
X0d_of_N0dthat's true01:03
vengfulsquirrelHa and people can walk in and buy beer out of the primary tank01:03
X0d_of_N0dso moving from seedlings to potted plants is tracked as a lot01:03
vengfulsquirrelwhich totally f's everything up01:03
X0d_of_N0dvengfulsquirrel: depends on how despirate they are01:03
vengfulsquirrelX0d_of_N0d: Well not really we don't track any lots, we don't have that granularity at all right now.01:16
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X0d_of_N0dACTION is back01:44
X0d_of_N0dvengfulsquirrel: how do you track sales?01:44
vengfulsquirrelX0d_of_N0d: Not very well pretty much, by paper I guess.  Moving over to tryton will move our business out of the 1800s into 2009.01:47
vengfulsquirrelX0d_of_N0d: Is your business doing Shop Floor Control and Capacity Planning right now ?01:48
X0d_of_N0dwe track everything that comes in and goes out....sometimes we loose track of it, but it's in the system at some point01:49
X0d_of_N0deverything we buy or use01:49
vengfulsquirrelAre you using a proprietary planning system now ?01:50
X0d_of_N0dyeah, it's pretty crappy01:54
X0d_of_N0dWe can track things fairly well, but it can't do the kind of planning we need01:54
X0d_of_N0dand we can't extend it without it breaking01:54
X0d_of_N0dand it's not supposed to run on linux01:55
X0d_of_N0dand it breaks ALL the time01:55
X0d_of_N0dit was chosen long before I came around01:56
X0d_of_N0dvengfulsquirrel: so are you implimenting production planning or just purchase planning?02:00
X0d_of_N0dor rather, do you need production planning or just purchase planning02:00
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X0d_of_N0dirc in emacs...that's cool02:03
udono1X0d_of_N`: Hi02:03
X0d_of_N0dhow goes it udono1?02:04
X0d_of_N0dACTION loves emacs02:04
udono1ACTION vi02:04
udono1X0d_of_N0d: A little ill, but ok so far02:04
X0d_of_N0dI'm pretty much down to 3 apps... firefox, claws-mail, and emacs02:05
X0d_of_N0dudono1: yeah, I've got a pretty bad cold02:05
udono1clawsmail I don't know...02:05
X0d_of_N0dclaws is a pretty cool mail client. it's a little buggy sometimes, but filtering is really nice02:06
udono1X0d_of_N0d: cedk told me about, IIRC02:07
X0d_of_N0dudono1: I really should switch to procmail + mutt or something, but I've gotten used to it02:07
X0d_of_N0dudono1: it's also nice because it's really easy to launch an external mail editor02:08
udono1X0d_of_N0d: I use Thunderbird and have my problems too02:09
X0d_of_N0dI really dislike thunderbird02:09
X0d_of_N0done of the other guys here uses it with muttator02:10
udono1X0d_of_N0d: after my last computer move I dislike it. Now I try Evolution, but its not better too02:10
X0d_of_N0devolution sucks too02:11
X0d_of_N0dclaws, imho, is the best gui mail client02:11
udono1X0d_of_N0d: ok, I will try it (next time I move)02:12
X0d_of_N0dso I was on vaccation until monday, and I've been sick for the last few days, so I haven't really made much progress on the module02:13
udono1X0d_of_N0d: February will be my LDAP month ... then I like to implement an LDAP connection for auth and partner/addresses/contact-mechanism. Next week I am on vaccation :-)02:14
X0d_of_N0dI worked a bit on it. I learned a lot about coding in tryton....02:14
X0d_of_N0dthen I went on vaccation and forgot everything02:14
udono1I have it every Monday...02:15
X0d_of_N0dI met a comrade from LA who was deep into Belgian beer02:16
X0d_of_N0dit was all downhill from there02:16
udono1X0d_of_N0d: Yes, belgian beer is great! I like it too.02:17
X0d_of_N0dI really love the sour belgians02:17
udono1X0d_of_N0d: did you have been in Belgium?02:19
X0d_of_N0dudono1: not yet02:20
X0d_of_N0dI've been to Canada and Mexico... Farthest east I've gone is New York when I was 3 or 402:21
X0d_of_N0dmany of my friends have traveled, I really haven't02:21
udono1X0d_of_N0d: So I've never been on the american continent... But maybe next year 2010...02:22
X0d_of_N0dwell... avoid the middle of the country, you won't miss anything worth seeing02:23
X0d_of_N0dbut here on the west coast, especially in "wine" country... awesome beer02:24
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vengfulsquirrelX0d_of_N0d: Hey sorry my roommate had to drop the internet and it ended up being much longer than expected.03:12
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cristi_anquestion of the day : tryton works with postgres09:47
cristi_anit uses specific sql calls from postgres that are not standart to other databases ?09:48
enlightxcristi_an: yes, you can use only postgresql, but there is no reasons to use another dbms :)10:01
enlightx(just joking)10:02
cristi_anseriously is that so hard to make it compatible with other DB ?10:12
cristi_anif the architecture is based on intrefaces then it should no be a big problem10:12
cristi_ani gues that db code is present only in the db layer10:14
enlightxcristi_an: i think you have to write tryton from scratch10:14
cristi_anwhat do you mean ?10:14
cristi_anto make it compatible with other db ?10:14
enlightxi mean that tryton uses psycopg which is the pgsql driver for python10:14
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cristi_anenlightx: you knwo java right ?10:15
cristi_anthere is easy to define a db intrerface and do implemetation for Mysql,SqlServer etc10:15
enlightxdon't use jdbc as example :)10:15
cristi_anand you use the driver accordingly10:16
cristi_anwhy ?10:16
enlightxtryton does't use a similar approach. it deals directly with postgres10:16
enlightxbut a nice feature would be migrate tryton from psycopg to sqlalchemy10:16
cristi_ani do not want to blame noone...but why ? they did nto thought on a layered apporoch ?10:17
enlightxcristi_an: just because tinyerp toke the wrong way10:17
cristi_ani wish i would not known java ,maybe it would have beeb easier for me to learn10:17
cristi_anpython and tryton10:18
enlightxbtw, i could be wrong and they already worked on this way to get this stuff replaceable10:20
enlightxhowever, you would have to rewrite every sql statement :)10:23
cristi_ani do not understand...100% not about an ORM10:24
cristi_anthat orm deal with object10:24
cristi_anand those objects ,add,remove,delete etc are handled in the orm class10:25
cristi_anso insert is not he same for all db ?10:25
cristi_anupdate as well10:25
Timitoscristi_an: only a short information as i need to do a phone call now...10:25
Timitoscristi_an: tryton has some functions in its orm that sqlalchemy or other orm does not have10:25
Timitoscristi_an: this makes a change difficult10:26
cristi_ani see10:26
Timitoscristi_an: tryton orm ist more than a orm10:26
cristi_anjust asked...10:26
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enlightxTimitos: what do you talking about?10:36
enlightxwhich functions?10:36
enlightxwe use sqlalchemy for zope3 which is more complex than tryton orm10:37
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Timitosenlightx: sorry. cedk mentioned that tryton orm has some functions that are not part of sql alchemy. perhaps i disunderstand something. but i think you should ask cedk for details10:46
enlightxTimitos: the mine wasn't a critic :) it was just to understand better10:47
cristi_anwell i guess this was inherited from tiny,and sice it working and it's doing its job there were other priorities ,higher ones10:47
Timitosenlightx: i understood it this way. this was not a critic for me. np10:47
enlightxsqlalchemy is quite flexible and customizable10:47
enlightxcristi_an: exactly10:48
cristi_anmaybe when time will permit the comunity will migrate and do it more flexible10:48
cristi_anjust my guess10:48
enlightxcristi_an: it would be nice, but i don't think that is a priority right now...but would be nice10:49
enlightxa step over openerp10:49
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udonoenlightx: cristi_an look at: The topic Re-factorize OSV/ORM will be the first step to make a later change of the ORM more possible.11:23
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udonoenlightx: cristi_an: and here is the discussion about:
enlightxudono: tnx!11:26
udonoenlightx: welcome11:26
cristi_anudono: those are good news11:28 is ok what it is for now11:29
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CIA-8tryton: matb roundup * #737/Contact mechanisms: actualization: [new] When inserting contact mechanisms, values for website are not actualized immediately after confirmation (as is done i.e. for phone), but onl ...12:58
bechameludono: cool13:59
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CIA-8tryton: matb roundup * #738/RfC: Comments in sale, purchase, invoice lines: [new] I would like to change description = fields.Char('Description', size=None, required=True) to description = fields.Text('Description ...15:11
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CIA-8tryton: C?dric Krier <> default * 36:b0570824e785 analytic_invoice/COPYRIGHT: Update copyright16:23
CIA-8tryton: C?dric Krier <> default * 37:057818ef62e3 analytic_invoice/ Fix read for not line type16:23
CIA-8tryton: C?dric Krier <> default * 36:11e9bb61ca9f analytic_purchase/COPYRIGHT: Update copyright16:24
CIA-8tryton: C?dric Krier <> default * 37:8fdb408d0e9d analytic_purchase/ Fix read of not line type16:24
CIA-8tryton: C?dric Krier <> default * 28:8d0d2fdd05e0 analytic_sale/COPYRIGHT: Update copyright16:24
CIA-8tryton: C?dric Krier <> default * 29:ada82231072b analytic_sale/ Fix read of not line type16:24
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CIA-8tryton: C?dric Krier <> default * 1150:02ff9a50588c tryton/tryton/gui/window/view_form/widget_search/ Add active field in search if not in the view but is defined.18:54
CIA-8tryton: C?dric Krier <> default * 1455:bc014149e76b trytond/trytond/osv/ (
CIA-8tryton: Add depends attributes to Columns.18:54
CIA-8tryton: It allow to specify a list of fields that are needed in the view for this one.18:54
CIA-8tryton: Add active field by default in each views.18:54
CIA-8tryton: C?dric Krier <> default * 1456:2fa2a8b9156c trytond/trytond/osv/ Add automaticaly field defined in sequence attributes in the view18:54
CIA-8tryton: C?dric Krier <> default * 226:2003fcfaa744 party/ ( contact_mechanism.xml):18:54
CIA-8tryton: Add other_value to display value in form view for issue737.18:54
CIA-8tryton: Otherwise value will have invisible state for some types in the tree view.18:54
CIA-8tryton: C?dric Krier <> default * 227:71c7b1fb5e01 party/ (address.xml category.xml contact_mechanism.xml party.xml): Remove tree_invisible field18:54
CIA-8tryton: ced roundup * #737/Contact mechanisms: actualization: [resolved] Fix with changeset 2003fcfaa74418:54
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CIA-8tryton: C?dric Krier <> default * 1457:1dac8d389b17 trytond/CHANGELOG: Add changelog20:31
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vengfulsquirrelOnce inventory is moved from the output zone to the customer location does it just sit there indefinitely?21:13
X0d_of_N0dvengfulsquirrel: yeah21:14
X0d_of_N0dvengfulsquirrel: unless it gets moved elsewhere21:14
X0d_of_N0dthat makes it so you can track inventory after it leaves your shop. That way if you need to know who has product xyz with rev w you can track it down... for example, in the case of a recall21:17
vengfulsquirrelYeah except 'Customer' is not actually granular right ?21:17
vengfulsquirrelCan you create actual customers as children of 'Customer' ?21:17
X0d_of_N0dI believe customer can be granular... perhaps I should look at that again21:18
X0d_of_N0dhum, yeah, I guess you would have to define children21:22
X0d_of_N0dit seems like any time you add a partner it should add a location for that partner depending on if their a supplier, customer, or both... I guess that could get a little confusing though21:24
vengfulsquirrelYeah seems like you'd have the order info and stuff anyways it would just be a matter of tracking individual lots or products.21:26
X0d_of_N0dI'm gonna get some lunch21:27
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bechamelvengfulsquirrel: there are "customer location" and "supplier are location" which are used when a pakcing are created22:29
vengfulsquirrelbechamel: -- Does the basic Wharehouse layout look correct here?  I'm trying out ideas to solve my problem.22:55
bechamelvengfulsquirrel: yes it's the basic architecture behind the code, except for the Plant which will comes with mrp :)22:57
bechamelvengfulsquirrel: i just realize that you created the graph (I though it was a coincidence that all the names were exactly matching the default config :), I'm a bit tired ... )23:00
vengfulsquirrelHa oh yeah, I'm trying to make the MRP module as well as some sort of Growing section to move plants between states of growth.23:01
vengfulsquirrelI was just thinking about where products would go that were used in production in a way that would match how products go into the Customer area when they are purchased.23:03
bechamelvengfulsquirrel: I'm not sure that input and output are needed for production, but i don't have a lot of knowledge about it23:07
bechamelvengfulsquirrel: for example, as long as products are not on a storage location the user cannot assing them to send a packing to a customer23:08
vengfulsquirrelbechamel: Yeah but how can you tell what's headed for production versus what's actually done?23:09
vengfulsquirrelI think maybe they should interface directly with the Storage area.23:11
bechamelvengfulsquirrel: yes, my sentence was not clear, waht I wanted to say is that another type of location is not needed, and yes it's better to created distinct inptu and output location (but both are of type production)23:12
bechamelvengfulsquirrel: what you put in the storage area will essentially impact reporting (do you consider that product in output zone are still part of your product, for example)23:14
vengfulsquirrelbechamel: Oh right you mean a Plant could just be another "Wharehouse" using the current system ?23:18
bechamelvengfulsquirrel: the plan can be a child of the warehouse23:20
bechamelvengfulsquirrel: and if you consider that the product for the production are part of the warehouse the production location can be under the storage location (nothing prevent to put production location under storage location)23:22
bechamelvengfulsquirrel: but in this cass i'm afraid that the asignation will assign products on those locations :(23:23
vengfulsquirrelYeah I think it makes more sense to move things out and in between storage and "production".23:24
vengfulsquirrelSo assignation to either customer orders or production runs doesn't happen when product are being used to produce something.23:25
bechamelvengfulsquirrel: yes but the system should ignore production locations when assigning customer packing23:28
vengfulsquirrelWait so you are saying make a new location type ? Or you are saying just use the Storage type but don't make it a child of the wharehouse's main storage location just put it under the actual Wharehouse ?23:31
bechamelvengfulsquirrel: there is already a type "production" on location23:32
vengfulsquirreloh snap23:32
vengfulsquirrelHa sorry, I did not see that.23:32
bechamelvengfulsquirrel: I think it could be a good idea to ask the mailing list for the best base layout of locations to handle correctly production (and like that I don't forget to think about it with a fresher mind)23:33
vengfulsquirrelYeah okay sounds good.23:34
bechamelvengfulsquirrel: time to sleep here, Bye23:35
vengfulsquirrelbye, thanks for the help23:35
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